Author Topic: Lid isolation  (Read 2644 times)

Offline skatbelt

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Lid isolation
« on: December 13, 2016, 11:24:19 AM »
Has anyone ever come to the thought of (or actually did) isolate the inside of the plastic lid to prevent mechanical noises coming thru? No need for this on stage of course but for home or studio use... I am thinking about trying.

Offline David Aubke

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2016, 11:34:18 AM »
Seems like it should work. Maybe something like this.
http://www.eastwood.com/autobody/sound-deadening.html
Dave Aubke
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Offline sean

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2016, 12:57:19 PM »

DynaMat or DynaPlate would be very similar.  I like the look of DynaPlate's smooth aluminum finish.

http://www.dynamat.com/automotive-and-transportation/car-audio/dynaplate/

I would assume that a car stereo custom store will have X-Mat, DynaMat, or something similar.  This stuff is relentlessly sticky, and impressively expensive.  The more layers you put on, the better the damping.

I think it would be very cool to know how well it works on the Rhodes.

Sean

Offline Julian

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2016, 07:33:29 AM »
I agree it would be an interesting project, & it may well improve the players experience. I notice, however, that the Dynamat product has an aluminium foil covering. Could this potentially cause any electrical noise issues? I assume also the high price is due to its ability to adhere to the complex curves associated with car interiors.

I have used a 'felt' sound deadening material on a car restoration. http://www.woolies-trim.co.uk/p-1384-sound-deadening-felt.aspx

The felt is quite heavy & is available in differing thicknesses. If you are thinking of doing this mod to a MK1 then the lid is a fairly simple shape internally & the felt may be a cheaper option. A MK2 lid may however prove more complex?

Just my 2c worth!

Kind regards
Julian

Offline freekey

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2016, 12:01:30 AM »
I did this with my student Rhodes with some adhesive backed foam from McMaster Carr and it really helped. Details can be seen in this thread: http://ep-forum.com/smf/index.php?topic=9220.msg50228#msg50228
« Last Edit: December 27, 2016, 12:03:28 AM by freekey »
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Offline pnoboy

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2016, 04:23:28 PM »
I did this with my student Rhodes with some adhesive backed foam from McMaster Carr and it really helped. Details can be seen in this thread: http://ep-forum.com/smf/index.php?topic=9220.msg50228#msg50228

I've used some adhesive-backed foam from McMaster (not on a Rhodes) whose adhesive was so strong that when it was time to remove the foam, it was essentially impossible--the adhesive was stronger than the foam so when trying to peel off the foam the adhesive was left behind and the foam came off, but not at all cleanly.  Fortunately, in my application, the foam was attached to a metal part, so I could use a strong solvent to loosen it--something not possible with a Rhodes cover.  This is just a little warning to try a small bit of any foam before putting on a large piece.  BTW, the adhesive in question was an acrylic adhesive--very commonly used in some tapes, etc.  If the foam was stronger than the adhesive, as is the case with many tapes, it would not have been a problem removing the foam.

Offline sean

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2016, 05:32:07 PM »

Oh, well, the Dynamat wouldn't be removable either.  It is super sticky.  It is like wrestling with tar.

I guess if you were trying to make a removable lining, or a test lining, you could first protect the lid interior with a layer of butcher paper, metale foil (tin, aluminum, or aluminium), or plastic wrap.  The grocery store will have fancy parchment paper for baking cookies.  You can even get it with a non-stick coating nowadays.

That would allow you to make a shell-within-a-shell sound deadening shield.  Sticky tape could hold it inside the lid when you want it to stay put (when you remove the lid).

Sean

Offline pnoboy

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2016, 08:57:20 AM »

Oh, well, the Dynamat wouldn't be removable either.  It is super sticky.  It is like wrestling with tar.

I guess if you were trying to make a removable lining, or a test lining, you could first protect the lid interior with a layer of butcher paper, metale foil (tin, aluminum, or aluminium), or plastic wrap.  The grocery store will have fancy parchment paper for baking cookies.  You can even get it with a non-stick coating nowadays.

That would allow you to make a shell-within-a-shell sound deadening shield.  Sticky tape could hold it inside the lid when you want it to stay put (when you remove the lid).

Sean

I think you mentioned what is probably the right way to to the job.  Buy foam that has no adhesive, and then buy a peelable adhesive to hold the foam on.  I think 3M makes peelable film adhesives, but I haven't checked recently.

Offline rhodesjuzz

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2016, 11:00:44 AM »

Oh, well, the Dynamat wouldn't be removable either.  It is super sticky.  It is like wrestling with tar.

I guess if you were trying to make a removable lining, or a test lining, you could first protect the lid interior with a layer of butcher paper, metale foil (tin, aluminum, or aluminium), or plastic wrap.  The grocery store will have fancy parchment paper for baking cookies.  You can even get it with a non-stick coating nowadays.

That would allow you to make a shell-within-a-shell sound deadening shield.  Sticky tape could hold it inside the lid when you want it to stay put (when you remove the lid).

Sean

I think you mentioned what is probably the right way to to the job.  Buy foam that has no adhesive, and then buy a peelable adhesive to hold the foam on.  I think 3M makes peelable film adhesives, but I haven't checked recently.

If somebody has an example of both foam and adhesive that is also available in Europe I'll be glad to hear that.  It is mainly for the higher octaves with harder hammer tips that generate that tacky sound. Thanks!!
Roy
1976 Rhodes Suitcase 73 <effects loop || EHX Holy Grail Nano>
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Offline skatbelt

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2017, 05:20:31 PM »
In the Netherlands this can be bought online at: http://www.akoestiekwinkel.nl/ I can imagine they sell to other EU countries as well.

Is was thinking about felt with an adhesive layer because it is known for its good absorption of middle and high frequencies.

Offline e-soul91

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2017, 02:36:24 PM »
I kinda like that clicking. But, I think DynaMat would work. We used it when I helped my friend soundproof his VW Beetle few years ago. And boy, did it reduce the engine noise. Don't see why it wouldn't work with Rhodes lid.
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Offline rhodesjuzz

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Re: Lid isolation
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2017, 04:54:13 AM »
Dynamat seems to be the right solution, but very expensive. 29 euro for 2 sheets of 25x25 cm.

But, thanks for the advice :)
1976 Rhodes Suitcase 73 <effects loop || EHX Holy Grail Nano>
Line 6 midi keys
Scarbee Mark I, A-200 and Classic EP-88S