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I heard about the upcoming MK XIV (have to skip a model number or two... blame it on "design and production issues").  It's a limited edition Tommy Hilfiger themed piano.  There are no tines or pickups, because you aren't supposed to play it, just show it off.  No legs or stand, either, but it mounts easily on a SUV hood.  

The MK XX is a Soviet themed piano, which only comes in red.  On Soviet themed Rhodes, piano plays YOU!

Unfortunately, I doubt your post will last long due to referencing a certain model that is totally taboo here.  I can't even give you a proper response, because that will also be deleted (sad), despite the fact that a senior member of the board uses said model as his avatar....

All I can tell you is that I would love to own a MKV, and that the negative atmosphere between fans of the vintage models and the makers of new electromechanical pianos (unless maker happens to be VV) is a real disservice to everyone who loves real electric pianos.

No matter what I do to F above middle C, it sounds even worse than your pinger   I've wondered about that pesky note.  Best guess:  Probably a bad tine, maybe a cheap replacement from before I bought my piano, or just a bad tine from the factory.  Either way, I have some spares, so I'll change it out and see if it helps.  Will report back later...

I love answering my own questions (maybe it will help someone else):  Simple hardware store fix.  New screws are chrome phillips instead of black flathead, but otherwise identical.  Also, I've found that tightening these screws (which causes the old ones to break) will raise the pitch a few cents, so if your T is a little flat, try replacing and tightening screws before you get in there with a file.

Howdy all.  Just bought a Pianet T in rough shape.  The screws that hold the reeds down are fragile and break easily.  Anyone know of a suitable replacement?

That low A could be a bad tine.  When the hammer strikes that low A, watch how the tine oscillates.  It should go strait up and down.  If it goes side to side, then the tip of the tine may be wavering away from the pickup.  VV has a video about bad tines that demonstrates this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BVvhpWqQ0k

Could also be that the tine is not tight against the tonebar, causing most of the vibration to be lost.

Problem solved.  I put a bath towel, folded in half the long way, on top of the Rhodes, and the clav on top of the towel.  Sits very snug, top is protected, zero modifications needed.  Not the prettiest solution, but very effective.

Lots of different factors affecting your tone.  Setting your timbre screw and adjusting your pickups is the easiest way to dial your tone, but others things are also very important, like escapement distance, hammer tip/damper/grommet/tonebar screw condition, how well your tone generators are set up (tine block tight against tonebar, tine ends even, tine aligned parallel to tonebar, tight fitting in harp).  Setting a proper strike line is sometimes overlooked but can make a big difference (my factory set strike line couldn't have been worse).  Having a quality preamp makes a world of difference, as does a quality tube amp, and will allow you to dial your sound more precisely.  The sound of a Rhodes tends to be thin without a preamp and some healthy gain (I like just enough to barely distort the notes on the hardest strikes), no matter how much you tweak the harp and action.  Without a preamp, you will be forced crank your amp, and depending on how it is biased and the power it has available, this can add noise and muddy up your tone.  Of course, if you play a Suitcase, the preamp/amp are not an issue, but if you play a Stage like me, then it is crucial.  I find a tiny bit of chorus and tremolo warm up the sound and give it character.

The beauty of Rhodes is you can tweak it all day long to get exactly the sound you are looking for (or maybe it's the curse, depending on how you feel about piano maintenance).  

Rockstardave, what was your Rhodes like when you first purchased it?

It looked a whole lot better than yours (no offense), but was in pretty rough shape.  A 1970 Stage 73 with half wood hammers, wood harp support blocks, Raymac tines, Marcel pedestal... too sweet not to resurrect.





I had corrosion and rust on the tone generators and hardware, drink rings on the harp frame, thrashed felts, hammer tips, tonebar screws, grommets, leaves and massive dust bunnies in the case, stiff action, no pedal, dirty/scratchy pots, miserable setup, scratched harp lid, all logos either broken or missing, filthy keytops.  I've fixed enough for it to look and sound good enough to gig with a few times a month, but it is an ongoing project.  Sorry for the oversized pics...




Check out my homemade sustain pedal

I want to put my clavinet on top of my Rhodes for gigs, but a few questions first....

I have a MKI 73 Stage, and the clav D6 is longer than the Rhodes, though the rubber feet will still fit on the Rhodes.  Anyone have any luck balancing a clav on a 73 key?  Will it just rock around and scratch/dent the harp cover?  I haven't tried it yet, because I'd rather not ruin my harp cover....

Anyone have any blueprints or suggestions for converting the road case cover into a frame (while still keeping it's functionality as a road case)?

Other ideas for fitting two huge, heavy keyboards on tiny stages?

Thanks!

Wow, and I thought my Rhodes was in bad shape when I got it.

I'm curious about the effect of the moisture on the piano.  All that wood must have swelled up, which could knock all kinds of things out of alignment, not to mention the action must feel like wet concrete.  I would put the whole thing in a kiln for awhile just to dry it out, then disassemble, sand, refinish, and pray everything still lines up properly when you put it back together....

[Moderator edit]

That is wicked awesome.  I want a  VVEP, and I ain't ashamed to say it :|

Can we puh-lease look under the hood now?

Moderator edit: edited to comply with posted forum rules.

My 1970 MKI has new VV screws, grommets, and washers (as well as some other VV parts).  I am very pleased with the final result.  The screws are just a hair larger than the originals, the washers fit very snug on the screws, and the grommets also fit tightly.  It can be a bit of a struggle to make it all sit together perfectly, but the final results are excellent.  A tight fitting, stable tone generator is important for good tone and sustain.  The old parts will probably fit together easily and somewhat loosely, which is exactly what you don't want.  Replacing screws is just as important as the grommets.  Loose or bent screws cause all sorts of voicing problems.

   These are tine-based electric pianos, set up with the classic Early Seventies tone.

The asymmetrical tuning fork is a closely guarded design, and you guys are no dummies.... which can only mean you invented a new style of tone generator.  Right?

Don't be coy.... what's under the hood?

A newly fabricated electric piano, or a "new" electric piano made from the parts of old pianos?  I wonder what Senor Brandstetter will say...

Priceless.

I worry about dust and somebody (me) spilling a beer on my baby, but I do sometimes play with the harp cover off at gigs for two reasons:

1.  On the fly adjustments.  Hear a tine clanking against a pickup, or a note that sounds a little too thin, or a damper not doing it's job?  Get a screwdriver in there while the guitarist is tuning.  Viola.  No more bad note, set continues.  Same reason some guys play without the screws that secure the harp to the blocks, so they can flip it up if needed to bend a damper arm or tune an errant note.

2.  A Rhodes harp is a beautiful work of design and artistic genius.  Nuff said.

Anyone out there with a complete preampsection with slider, switches and preamp for a black D6/E7 that they would consider selling? PM me...

You probably already know this, but clavinet.com sells an internally shielded, upgraded preamp.  The rest could be improvised if need be, as it is just basic switches and a pot, but the preamp board is the hard part.  Good luck!

Put new hammer tips on (removing the old ones was a pretty disgusting job... they deteriorate over time and turn to a sticky goo substance) and a fresh 9v battery, put it all back together and plugged it into my amp.  Sounds amazing, surprisingly little hum or hiss when placed away from the amp.  Fairly in tune, too.  That loose wire doesn't seem to make a bit of difference, so I'm just leaving it (as a wire tie).  The strings are very brittle and prone to breakage, which I discovered by accidentally turning the wrong tuning peg when replacing a treble string.  Grrr.... Replacing strings is even less fun than the hammer tips   but I'll probably have to do that now, too.  Very surprising how well these respond to a little attention and maintenance.  One pickup has a small crack in the plastic casing, but thankfully it hasn't compromised the wiring or coiling, both pickups are loud and clear.  Not destined to go to gigs, but one of the best home studio pieces a fella could wish for.

I have never seen the inside of a clav before- what is that astro turf looking stuff?

Me neither until a few days ago!

The astro turf is actually just the paint job, which seems original (it's under the serial number tag).  Kind of a faux granite speckled look, though totally smooth to the touch.  Neato.

Looks like an improvised wire tie to me.

That flickr set is great. He did some great work on that busted ass D6.

It is definitely soldered on to the terminal at one end, and there is a chunk of solder on the dangling end.  I'll have to go over the diagram more closely.... maybe it's a replacement for something a previous owner broke, though less elegant in execution than the original wiring.  I can only wonder what people were thinking.  I removed the tin foil/duct tape preamp shield, which apparently cracked the preamp board.

It is a great photo set, very helpful for somebody with clav parts all over the floor, too.

Howdy.  Got a "new" Clav D6 this week, needs a lot of work.

For now, just wondering about this loose black wire under the rocker tabs, coming off the C D tab, coiled around a few other wires and dangling about:
http://www.4shared.com/photo/6OiubCE6/IMG_2875.html

I don't see it in the wiring diagram, it looks sloppy... maybe a misguided attempt at grounding?  Or did I totally miss something in the diagram (from clavinet.com)?

Also, looking at this guy's clav, I don't see it:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/31603983@N05/4471894359/in/photostream/

Thanks, good to see the forum back up again!

Howdy!  That's a fine job you are doing restoring your Rhodes...

I had a listen to the video, and the damping problems you are having with some notes sounded very familiar.  Sounds like many damper arms aren't clearing the swing of the tines, which can cause quiet notes with extra mechanical noise.  I adjusted my dampers four of five times and still couldn't eliminate this problem, even with new VV felts.  I finally tried shimming up the harp, which it looks like someone has done to yours, and it cured virtually all my problems with bad damping.

I'm no tech, but it seems that this allows for much needed room between the tine and felt when the key is depressed.  Instead of dampers which push against the tine and barely clear the swing, I was able to set the dampers so they are just touching the tine but dropping well below the swing.  It also increases the escapement, which in turn eliminated a lot of double striking hammers.

Your shims look to be very short, perhaps less than an 1/8 inch.  I shimmed mine roughly 2/8 inch and had great results.  It would also give you a chance to check your strikeline.  

Good luck with the restoration, and let us know how it goes!

The 3M goop showed up in the mail, started gluing the tips back on.  Works like a charm, but it is crazy stuff!  It wants to continue flowing out of the tube, when I only want a little dot!  I recommend putting a little on an applicator (I'm using a qtip) rather than sticking the whole tube in your piano.  It has a tendency to make a mess, and according to the label, has chemicals that cause cancer and birth defects, so gloves and a well ventilated room are probably good ideas, too.

Thanks for the replies, I found the 3M stuff, in the DIY materials section of the site, actually :oops:


I'm ordering a tube, but the Rhodes won't make it to the show.  I told the guys I would bring my MIDI setup instead.  Frowns all around.  Hammond it is...

I glued all my NOS neoprene tips on with super glue, and after a few weeks of playing, they started falling off.    I removed them all, I'm scraping the wood portion of the hammer clean with a razor (which I originally did, painstakingly, with all the old tips), and I'm starting over.

I tried Gorilla Glue.  Worse than the super glue.

I tried Amazing Goop.  Worse yet.

I have a gig on Saturday, and all my hammer tips are in a plastic bag.

:shock:

A little help, please?  (I really don't want to haul the Hammond to the gig...)

You can make your own pedal, too, it's actually pretty simple:

http://ep-forum.com/smf/index.php?topic=4698.msg26908#msg26908

 I just made one out of scrap lumber, a few bits of metal, and a couple large tonebar screws.  Works great.

A good sounding 88 key Rhodes in great shape for $400?

You didn't get ripped off.

You got the deal of a lifetime.  Congrats!

I paid $275 for a 73 key in bad shape.  I've put over fifty hours and a couple hundred dollars into restoring it, and it's still not done.  Consider yourself blessed by the electric piano gods... ':D'

Short answer:  depends on how thorough you want to be, and how perfect you want the harp cover to look.

Check out the very end of this thread... This fellow completely sanded and repainted:

http://ep-forum.com/smf/index.php?topic=5988&start=15&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=harp+cover+restoration

Or, if you want to do something a little easier, and less expensive and time consuming, try black boot polish.  That was suggested to me on this forum, and it worked pretty well for five minutes of work, but not perfect.  Good enough to look awesome under the stage lights, anyway!

Where else?

http://www.fenderrhodes.com/history/memorial.php

The second to the last entry in the memorial section, Jim Wray writes:

"We have many hours of filmed footage of Harold in preparation for a documentary of his life. The sound track (with a Rhodes piano of course) for a trailer created to promote the film was said by his wife Margit to have been instrumental in his recovery from stomach surgery about 6 years ago."

Sounds a lot like an RMI ElectraPiano with the Harpsichord and Piano settings blended...  A local guitar shop has an ElectraPiano, it was $99, but then I complained it was out of tune to the owner, so he had it serviced.  Now it's $399 ~

Hard to say from the pics, but it looks like somebody put tuning springs on those old style damper arms to hold the bridle straps in place... the "white stuff" is probably oxidation, since they probably haven't been touched since being installed.

Yeah, that's the same stand I have, and its the same stand that tipped, lol :p

lol

Ah great.  Just when I got over my paranoia about my about my stand.  ':|'

Perhaps it can be modified... adding a couple brackets to hold the piano in place is a possibility I was mulling over, but now it looks like I'm gonna have to it for my own peace of mind.

Besides which, I'd be real embarrassed crying my little heart out in front of a crowd if it ever fell at a gig ':oops:'

I put my Rhodes legs in the closet... I've been using this:

http://accessories.musiciansfriend.com/product/On-Stage-Stands-Pro-Platform-Keyboard-Stand?sku=450384

It looks to be somewhat similar to the MK V stand.  It looks a little rickety, but it's actually quite solid, rated at 230lbs, almost two Rhodes!  Case in point, I bumped it pretty hard the other day, and the piano shifted on the stand, but didn't even come close to falling over.

A piano repairman taught me a trick yesterday for fixing gouges in the wood of any instrument.

1)  Get a rag damp and squeeze as much water out as you can.

2)  Cover the gouge with the towel and lightly iron it.  Allow the wood to cool, and repeat this a few times.

3)  In a few days, the wood should expand in that spot enough to raise the gouge.  This way, you can lightly sand away the uneven surface.

Luckily, my Rhodes didn't come with any deep wounds, just very minor abrasions to the tolex.  I do, however, have a couple guitars and a couple Hammond organs that I might try this on.

My keybed has the same overspray.  Pretty typical, I think.

Maybe some glow in the dark paint would be cool!  Then you could flip off the lights and see the glow between the keys

Total newbie, non-tech, but here's my 2-cents:

This may make a few people cringe, but I was working on my tolex last night with a regular black Sharpie.  I had already cleaned it with some soapy water, a toothbrush (ugh), and some rags.  I "filled" in the minor scrapes and bruises with the Sharpie and quickly wiped away the excess ink. Some previous owner jerk also spray painted something white a little too close to my Rhodes, at some point in it's long, neglected life, so I was able to cover up the hundreds of tiny paint splatters, too.  Finished it off with ArmorAll, and I can't stop looking at it

I tried using a camera to "see" how this looked in higher definition, under different light sources.  On a couple areas where I didn't wipe up the extra ink (oops) it is just barely noticeable under the lens, and pretty much undetectable to the naked eye.  Overall, the tolex looks new.  I have to practically put my nose against it to see the imperfections.

If you want to stain the entire case back to black, I'd suggest a tiny bit of black ink dilluted in a lot of water and a rub down with gloves and a rag your significant other won't miss  I almost did this, but didn't find it necessary after the other steps I took.  

This was also a good opportunity for me to remove the case hardware and scrub it with some steel wool and metal polish.  Shiny!  Also a good idea so you don't mar it with ink.

And don't play while you do this!  I almost started jamming out on those pristine white keys, then I looked at my ink stained finger tips and thought better of it.

Hope that helps, it sure did the trick for me.  My 20 year old guitar amp tolex is next!

You should still be frothing!  Steal the action from a junker craigslist piano and retrofit it!

I've heard rumors of a documentary.  Anybody know anything?

Restoration is going great!  Replaced all the hammer tips, took all the keys off, vacuumed out the case, replaced the upstop felt on the name rail, scrubbed the tone generators to a dull shine, polished the guide pins, lots of general cleaning, tightening screws, inspecting parts, etc.  Waiting on a bottle of Slide All in the mail to lube and reassemble.  New grommets, tonebar screws, damper felts, and pedestal felts will come when I get the cash, but I've replaced the worst offenders.

Anyone ever try vacuuming felts to revive them?  I've been delicately vacuuming all the felts, which makes an obvious difference in their appearance and spring.

thanks for the replies, very helpful.  Yes, the hammer tips are indeed felt, or rather wood covered in felt.  Old style.

Another question couple questions:  any tricks, besides Scotch Brite, for restoring/cleaning tonebar assemblies?  Mine look better after hours of scrubbing, but still dull and corroded (they seem to sound fine, though).

Also, I've read the top harp cover can be painted black to restore its shine.  Any suggestions on type of paint?

Hello.  New member to the forum.  Been fiddling with digital knockoffs for years, dreaming of the real deal.  I finally picked up a 1970 Stage 73 MK I recently.  A little beat, but a very good candidate for restoration.  Replaced some chewed up grommets and bent tonebar screws, cleaned the tuning forks with Scotch Brite, did some voicing, and its really coming together.  Still planning on a full replacement of hammer tips, damper felts, grommets, and tonebar screws.  I've done lots of research, I have the service manual, just have a few questions.  My apologies if this has all been discussed a million times, a link to an old thread would do just as well as an answer:

1)  I have factory felt hammer tips, which actually don't sound half bad after lowering the escapement.  I have enough neoprene tips to do a replacement, but I noticed something... the furtherest eight treble hammers get smaller and softer, but I thought it was supposed to be the other way around... small, soft tips on the bass end, working up to harder, smaller tips on the treble end.  What gives?

2)  What's the best method for cutting tines to size?  Have lots of replacements, but they're all cut to the same length--way too long.

3)  Aside from the pedestal bump and adding a backcheck system, are there any other mods to this vintage of Rhodes that are worth doing?

5)  I'm voicing the low end gritty, the mid range extra gritty and percussive, and gradually edging the treble end towards bell tones (my favorite arrangement), but that last part is a little tricky.  Any tips for getting good bell tones out of the high end?  

Thanks for reading.