i could use some help/tips refurbishing a 71 rhodes

[phaedrus]

Hi, I'm new here. Joined up because I bought a Rhodes from Craigslist for $500. It Is in pretty bad shape, so I'm going through and refurbishing it.

I've taken the action all apart and am replacing all the felts at the moment, cleaning as I go.

I bought the hammer/action refurbishing kit from Vintage Vibe to do it, but I have some questions before moving on to the tines/tonebars/pickups.

Do you have any tips for removing old glue from the damper arms? I need to get rid of it so I can glue down the new felts. I've tried denatured alcohol, but that didn't seem to do anything. This stuff seems indestructible.

Pic of glue:
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[phaedrus]

More pics so you can see what I'm working withYou cannot view this attachment.You cannot view this attachment.You cannot view this attachment.

[phaedrus]

More:

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[The Real MC]

Naphtha, but use it outside or in well ventilated area.

[phaedrus]

Naphtha, but use it outside or in well ventilated area.

Thanks, I have some so I'll give it a shot.

[phaedrus]

I ended up using a random orbital sander to tak eoff the old glue. Soaking in naptha for 3 days did nothing

[phaedrus]

any tips on how to fix sticky keys?

[phaedrus]

i think im ready to start putting the felts on the back of the keys. the question i have is, can i install the miracle mod on this style of key? ive watched the videos from VV and the slope on these keys make it look like there's no room to install the little bump. see the pic below:
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any thoughts would be appreciated!

thanks

[sean]

You should be able to sneak the bump in there even on those sloped-front key pedestals.  But I agree that it might be perilously close to the slope.  Lots of experimentation and fiddling, I suppose.

For encouragement, see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4keFGrcQSwQ

Sean


Also, I had always wondered if the action was placed too far back, but I sold my 1973 Rhodes.  So now I can't experiment with that.

[spave]

It's hard to tell from the photos but based on the build date of your piano, there's a chance that your keys have the marcel pedestals that don't require the miracle mod.

See here for a picture of what the Marcel looks like: https://www.vintagevibe.com/products/fender-rhodes-key-curved-marcel-pedestal

See here for what the regular slanted pedestal looks like: https://www.vintagevibe.com/products/fender-rhodes-keys-vintage-slanted-pedestal

Also, if you do have the regular slanted pedestal it is still possible to add the miracle mod.

[phaedrus]

wow... i didnt know there were two variations of slanted keys! thanks.

looking at a few of them.... there is a very slight curve in them, not sure if thats just from use or if it is intentional. wouldnt be surprised if they were marcel though. i did have to sand to remove the old glue but i only used 220, and just enought to remove the old glue/felt remnants.
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[phaedrus]

also for replacing the back rail felt, should i just use super glue? i dont want to use up all the special glue they sent me with the VV kit.

[spave]

wow... i didnt know there were two variations of slanted keys! thanks.

looking at a few of them.... there is a very slight curve in them, not sure if thats just from use or if it is intentional. wouldnt be surprised if they were marcel though. i did have to sand to remove the old glue but i only used 220, and just enought to remove the old glue/felt remnants.
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Those look like the Marcel to me. The miracle mod essentially replicates the curve that those already have from the factory. You could still technically put the mod on anyway to make the key feel even lighter but the general consensus on the forum over the years is that the Marcel pedestals don't really need it.

[phaedrus]

new question.

i have started work on the tines and electronics. mostly just removing the tonebars and tines and assessing their state.

there seems to be a fair amount of corrosion. see here:

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any ideas and/or tips for cleaning it up? or is it not worth it?

[sean]

Okay, step 1 is to order new grommets.  When they finally arrive, you can start removing the tonebars.

I would clean the tonebars with soap and water, or just wipe them with a wet rag.  I would not suggest digging in to the chromate covering.  If you are insanely rich, you can send them out to have them acid cleaned and re-plated or painted (it is not really that expensive).  The minor rust and zinc oxides are a nuisance, but they don't matter in the sound.

The tines themselves can be cleaned and polished to your heart's content with steel wool, brillo pads, or just oil or WD-40.  (Don't do this anywhere near the piano.)  I would pull off the tuning spring, and get most of the rust off.  When you are done, make sure you give the tines a wipedown with rust-protective oil.  I have used cooking oil sometimes.  I don't like WD-40 for this, because I am afraid it will damage the hammer-tips.  After you get the oil on the tine, wipe it off.  Wipe it off again, until it feels dry.

The tuning springs can be cleaned in your daughter's ultrasonic jewelry cleaner.  Dry and oil them lightly to discourage rust.

The only pain about this process is that you have to re-tune every single tine.  Ugh, so if the rust on the tines is not bad, you can skip removing the tuning spring.

I think replacement tuning springs are still stupidly expensive, right? A dollar each?  No thanks.

The good thing about this process is that you will replace the grommets at the same time.  That will be a huge improvement in the tone.

Also, when you are bolting the tine back onto the tonebar, I suggest that you put the tine block in your bench vise, and then turning the wrench tight while holding a finger on the tip of the tonebar to keep it aligned with the tine. 

Look out for rogue tonebars that have been accidentally bent where they twist.  Make sure the free end of the tonebar is lined up perfectly with the mounting holes at the other end of the tonebar.

That's all I can think of here.

Sean

[sean]

Oh, BTW, I think that if that is the marcel curve, it is really subtle.

Compare it to the second photo here:
https://www.vintagevibe.com/products/fender-rhodes-key-curved-marcel-pedestal

In any case, you can still install the miracle mod on those key pedestals.

Read all of Ben's Miracle Mod Bible and the related discussion:
https://ep-forum.com/smf/index.php?topic=4666.0

And also see this comment about Miracle-Mod-on-Marcel:
https://ep-forum.com/smf/index.php?topic=4666.msg44658#msg44658

Sean

[ununiform]

I would recommend against the bump mod on a set of Marcel pedestals. I bought the kit and was prepared to install when I discovered the type of pedestal on my Rhodes. Did a bunch of experiments with placement and determined the bump mod atop a Marcel would mess up the escapement. Now that it's all assembled I'm glad I didn't. The action is really nice as is.

[ununiform]

Regarding getting the glue off the damper arms. A rag with acetone. That glue doesn't respond well to naphtha.

Regarding sticky keys. If you want to go all the way you'll want to replace the key bushings on each key. The best method is to invest in a set of key cauls (I used 0.146" as it was the measurement of my key pins) and the right thickness of bushing felt. (0.43" was what I used). Your measurements might vary but probably not. Mine was a 1972 with Marcel pedestals. So yours are probably the same. But you can double check by removing your old bushings and measuring the gap with accurate calipers. Measure a bunch of keys and average them as the old felts could leave some remnant glue throwing off some measurements. Then measure the key pins and assume the felt will be the difference between the key pin measurements and the gap divided by 2 pieces of felt.

Do yourself a favor and get the 45 caul set and felt from Howard piano industries. Get at least two or three lengths of felt.

Once that is all done if there are any sticky keys, know the front key pins are oblong and some may need to be rotated as they go from a good fit on axis to tight off axis.

Then once they smooth get yourself some PTFE powder and dust all the felts. Voila. Buttery smooth.