Author Topic: Restoration Thread - Show us Pics of your work! (Read 50147 times)

Tim Hodges · « **on:** February 15, 2010, 02:35:49 PM »

I thought about starting this to show the before and after shots of our restoration work, especially as SpaceDuck is now starting to re-tolex his Rhodes I thought it might be a good idea. Plus it would be useful to put any tips for future work.

So here is my Rhodes

This I bought in a bit of a sorry state as you will see, the eBay seller described the inside as good and with a slight bit of corrosion on the tines and tonebars! It cost me £600 and an extra £100 for the lid as he initially didn't want to sell it with one. It had deep scratches on the harp cover, red wax on the keys and lid and white paint all over it, no legs/braces or sustain pedal & rod, I was happy though!

Before:

Rusted Tines & Pickups

Ripped tolex

After I sanded down and re-sprayed the harp but the rest still required restoring

Scratched lid

After

Mark II · « **Reply #1 on:** February 15, 2010, 04:14:08 PM »

looks good.
what did you do against the rust ?
kind regards
Mark II

Tim Hodges · « **Reply #2 on:** February 15, 2010, 04:25:35 PM »

Quote from: "Mark II"

looks good.
what did you do against the rust ?
kind regards
Mark II

Thanks MK II!

The harp frame I sanded down using a delta sander for a nice even finish which completely removed the rust. I then used a grey primer and added roughly 7 or so coats of gold to give it a good level of protection. In between each layer I lightly sanded it down to smooth out the finish.

The pickups I used an ordinary dremmel, there was so much rust on them by the 73 note there was nothing left of the wire brush!
The tines, I sanded down using fine sandpaper and the tone generators I initially used the wire brush of the dremmel (what was left of it) to remove the white oxidisation but some of the tines required a bit more effort so I used some fine sandpaper on the sander, the end picture is a perfect example.
The tonebars however need a proper acid bath and re-plate so instead I purchased a clean set off eBay off a MK1 88 key for about £40. My plan is to sort out the existing tonebars and probably sell them on.

T

drcarver · « **Reply #3 on:** February 15, 2010, 04:47:02 PM »

You beat me to it!

Oh well, your resto looks great!

Here's some of mine:

I didn't take too many pics, but here's what I've done so far:

Eased all keys
Adjusted strike line
New damper felts
New hammer tips
New tolex
New Grill cloth
Painted the lid
Gold Painted hardware
Backcheck mod

Here's the before pic. It looked pretty decent, but needed a few tweaks. The tolex was ripped in a few areas. I told myself I was just going to work on the inside stuff, but lost control pretty quickly.

The lid had wax all over it so I decided to sand and repaint.

After a few coats of primer

After several coats of paint and clear (It is pretty sparkly, but for some reason doesn't photo well)

I was in the zone while doing the tolex and grillcloth, but I managed to snap a couple of pics with my phone.

After

Tim Hodges · « **Reply #4 on:** February 15, 2010, 05:03:47 PM »

Thanks drcarver!

That suitcase just looks superb, when I first saw it about a month ago I wasn't too sure about the crocodile tolex but now I love it! It definitely works.

It's amazing how far it can spiral out of control when you just aim to do one thing

even now I still want to alter little things on the piano, 1 I need to add the miracle mod, that should arrive on Thursday. 2 I want to get the keys re-bushed (£40) and I also want to replace the front Rhodes badge on the rail (couple of nicks on it) and the seventy three logo because it's missing an e off the end. Perhaps do the back check mod, but I don't know yet. I really don't know what I'll do with myself when I've done it though! I'll probably get another one which needs a lot of work

Did you coat the gold paint with a varnish afterwards? I'm impressed at how much you managed to sand down, it looks as if you built the lid and box yourself.

T

drcarver · « **Reply #5 on:** February 15, 2010, 05:21:47 PM »

Quote from: "tjh392"

Thanks drcarver!

That suitcase just looks superb, when I first saw it about a month ago I wasn't too sure about the crocodile tolex but now I love it! It definitely works.

Did you coat the gold paint with a varnish afterwards? I'm impressed at how much you managed to sand down, it looks as if you built the lid and box yourself.

T

I went back and forth on the croc tolex, but I'm glad I got it. It is quite a bit thicker than the original and a little tough to work with, but it is amazing up close when finished.

I did use a clear varnish over the gold. I let the paint and the varnish cure for 1 week each. It still didn't turn out like I had hoped, and it is coming off in a few places, but I still think it looks better than the old stuff that was on there before. Someone should really manufacture brass hardware.

Also, I highly recommend the backcheck mod.

MichaelHammar · « **Reply #6 on:** February 18, 2010, 03:50:59 AM »

Question to those who've been doing restoration: Where can I find black chrome hardware (not matte black)?

I'd like to redo my Rhodes MKII and have been looking for black chrome hardware but haven't been able to find any yet.

Any info would be greatly appreciated! thanks!

Tim Hodges · « **Reply #7 on:** February 18, 2010, 04:13:42 AM »

Hi Michael

I can honestly say I've never seen some before, I don't think they even manufacture it for Fender (at least not as standard)

The only option I could Imagine is getting a local company to chrome it for you, but that would be very expensive.

Sorry

T

MichaelHammar · « **Reply #8 on:** February 18, 2010, 05:37:54 AM »

Quote from: "tjh392"

Hi Michael

I can honestly say I've never seen some before, I don't think they even manufacture it for Fender (at least not as standard)

The only option I could Imagine is getting a local company to chrome it for you, but that would be very expensive.

Sorry

T

Thanks T!

Yeah, I haven't come across any such hardware online neither have suppliers been able to locate any. I think my only option is to have them chromed by a shop which isn't that bad since I have some parts to chrome for my chopper (bike), I'll see about throwing the hardware and also the legs as well in for them to chrome.... Just not sure if it'll be easy to chrome latches though...

drcarver · « **Reply #9 on:** February 18, 2010, 08:29:10 AM »

I don't think anyone manufactures them. A good chrome shop should be able to handle the latches with no problems, but it will cost you. I did a pretty extensive search for gold hardware when I was restoring my Rhodes, but ended up just using spraypaint.

pianotuner steveo · « **Reply #10 on:** February 18, 2010, 09:00:29 AM »

Excellent job, drcarver...love the color choices

drcarver · « **Reply #11 on:** February 18, 2010, 09:04:03 AM »

^Thanks! I was on the fence about the orange(it was supposed to be a darker, metallic copper), but I'm warming up to it.

The_Cause · « **Reply #12 on:** February 21, 2010, 09:34:22 PM »

Hi T;

I have access to a Dremel and was thinking of using it to remove some rust/corrosion on my MKII pickups. Did you just leave the pickups in place? Also which wire brush did you use?

Thanks!

quote="tjh392"]

Quote from: "Mark II"

looks good.
what did you do against the rust ?
kind regards
Mark II

Thanks MK II!

The harp frame I sanded down using a delta sander for a nice even finish which completely removed the rust. I then used a grey primer and added roughly 7 or so coats of gold to give it a good level of protection. In between each layer I lightly sanded it down to smooth out the finish.

The pickups I used an ordinary dremmel, there was so much rust on them by the 73 note there was nothing left of the wire brush!
The tines, I sanded down using fine sandpaper and the tone generators I initially used the wire brush of the dremmel (what was left of it) to remove the white oxidisation but some of the tines required a bit more effort so I used some fine sandpaper on the sander, the end picture is a perfect example.
The tonebars however need a proper acid bath and re-plate so instead I purchased a clean set off eBay off a MK1 88 key for about £40. My plan is to sort out the existing tonebars and probably sell them on.

T[/quote]

Tim Hodges · « **Reply #13 on:** February 22, 2010, 09:55:13 AM »

Quote from: "The_Cause"

Hi T;

I have access to a Dremel and was thinking of using it to remove some rust/corrosion on my MKII pickups. Did you just leave the pickups in place? Also which wire brush did you use?

Thanks!

Hi!

I took the entire harp off the piano, removed the tonebar rail from the harp and left the pick-up rail in situ to save all the hassle.

This was the sort of brush I used:

http://www.plumbersurplus.com/Prod/Dremel-532-Stainless-Steel-Brush-End-Shape-%285-Pack%29/95620/Cat/1259?RefID=CJ

I initially tried this brush:

http://www.rainydaymagazine.com/RDM2008/RainyDayGarage/TireTote/WireBrushBig.jpg

But then spent most of the day avoiding the stray wire which would come loose and propel itself into me. So avoid it if you can, but if you can't wear some thick clothing (more than a t-shirt) and some goggles!

Once I finished cleaning the pickups with the top wire brush they looked perfect. Oh and make sure you've removed any filings left over afterwards, the magnet will hold onto it and you increase the chance of them shorting out when you power it up. So either use some compressed air or go over them with a cloth or brush and make sure nothing is left on them.

Hope this helps!

T

The_Cause · « **Reply #14 on:** February 22, 2010, 06:08:17 PM »

Quote from: "tjh392"

Quote from: "The_Cause"
Hi T;

I have access to a Dremel and was thinking of using it to remove some rust/corrosion on my MKII pickups. Did you just leave the pickups in place? Also which wire brush did you use?

Thanks!

Hi!

I took the entire harp off the piano, removed the tonebar rail from the harp and left the pick-up rail in situ to save all the hassle.

This was the sort of brush I used:

http://www.plumbersurplus.com/Prod/Dremel-532-Stainless-Steel-Brush-End-Shape-%285-Pack%29/95620/Cat/1259?RefID=CJ

I initially tried this brush:

http://www.rainydaymagazine.com/RDM2008/RainyDayGarage/TireTote/WireBrushBig.jpg

But then spent most of the day avoiding the stray wire which would come loose and propel itself into me. So avoid it if you can, but if you can't wear some thick clothing (more than a t-shirt) and some goggles!

Once I finished cleaning the pickups with the top wire brush they looked perfect. Oh and make sure you've removed any filings left over afterwards, the magnet will hold onto it and you increase the chance of them shorting out when you power it up. So either use some compressed air or go over them with a cloth or brush and make sure nothing is left on them.

Hope this helps!

T

Awesome thanks T - I'll look into that Dremel brush for the job

shmuelyosef · « **Reply #15 on:** February 23, 2010, 11:15:01 PM »

These guys sell all the hardware in black or chrome:

http://www.mojotone.com/amp-parts/Corners/Mojotone-Black-3-Leg-Corners-No-Lip-Set-of-4-with-Screws

Spaceduck · « **Reply #16 on:** March 10, 2010, 08:45:54 AM »

Great thread!! The information & especially the pics are really inspiring.

It's been almost a month since I started re-tolexing, and all I've got done is the lid

I ended up spending weeks trying to glue the cracks, fill the chips & straighten the warped wood. It probably would've been quicker if I had just rebuilt the whole chassis from scratch, but I'm glad I stuck with the original stuff for the sake of keeping it authentic. The tips here & in the other thread about tolex were really helpful, and I haven't made any mistakes so far.

Now I have some questions about paint & hardware...

Drcarver, that's a great job you did painting the plastic cover. It looks like you got the "leather" effect on the gold top. I remember an old thread where someone mentioned using a hair dryer somehow. Is that how you did it?

Hardware: I also tried painting my hardware (silver), but the paint keeps peeling off. Would a clearcoat help? What other options do I have? Since I don't have the budget to get it chromed, I was thinking I might try removing all the paint, then sanding & polishing the hardware with this Ryobi compound I got at Home Depot for $3. Has anyone tried that?

drcarver · « **Reply #17 on:** March 10, 2010, 09:37:05 AM »

For the lid, I just gave it a light sanding and painted. The plastic has the "leather" look to it, so when you paint over it, the paint will take on the same shape. I did 2 coats of primer, 4 coats of color, and 2 coats of clear. I used a fairly expensive automotive paint from a company called Alsa, and am wondering if I could have gotten the same results with krylon for the color. The clear was a 2-part formula that hardened quickly and really turned out nice.

I also painted my hardware, and it is flaking off just a little, but not really that noticable. I sprayed the gold, let it cure for a week, then sprayed a clear laquer and let that cure for a week. It is pretty strong, and definitely cheaper than a chrome shop. For some reason though, the varnish took a little bit of the shininess out of the gold paint, but it doesn't look that bad. For the hardware, I used krylon products.

solyaris · « **Reply #18 on:** May 25, 2010, 08:01:03 AM »

My restoration work-in progress photos:

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2042940&id=1169037408&l=e46cea71c5

sorry for story report in Italian there.

giorgio

Tim Hodges · « **Reply #19 on:** May 25, 2010, 10:35:22 AM »

Wow what's going on with that tine in the last image!!

The piano looks fantastic from the outside, that will be a fun restoration. Oh and before you throw away the broken tine generator keep it so that you can set the escapement (matches the specifications perfectly)

I can't wait to see photos of it when all the rust has been removed etc.

Tim

Spaceduck · « **Reply #20 on:** May 25, 2010, 11:19:07 AM »

Hey cool, I'm glad this thread has been bumped up. I need some inspiration!

solyaris, that's how the inside of mine looks. Everything's there intact, but there's a lot of cleaning to do. The outside looks great in those 2 pictures. Did you do that yourself?

My Rhodes has been sitting on the dining room table since the last time I posted in March. The new tolex looks great, top & bottom, but now I need to do something about the hardware and I'm dragging my heels.

solyaris · « **Reply #21 on:** May 26, 2010, 02:27:17 AM »

Hi all

Quote from: "Spaceduck"

that's how the inside of mine looks. Everything's there intact, but there's a lot of cleaning to do. The outside looks great in those 2 pictures. Did you do that yourself?

* honestly, is my new camera and a lucky light that generated this apparently perfect oustide ... indeed the piano is not clean at all also outside.

* inside, is a disaster, only one tine broke but 11 pick-ups dead, and a lot of rust everywhere and main electrical cable to be re-done...

* Surprisingly the mechanic of keyboard have been repaired successfull in few hours! I followed suggestion by a vintagevibe.com video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU4E7osDm6M&feature=related

* Yes I decided to do myself the reparation, because I'm in Italy, and here is difficult and expensive to find someone that have competences to rapair, so I decided to skill myself ... and I'm not a keyboard player ...

* The sad thank about this 1979 mark I is how stupidly have been keep ...
probably in a basement or anyway in a humid place, not working for years...
I know the piano have been played mainly in a Rehearsal studio...
it was usual in Italy in pop-rock-jazz rehearsal studios in '80s to have a rhodes as (almost) only keyboard in the studio ... and the players wa all sort of people...

Also it seem to me that the instrument have been repaired ... in superficial way ... probably for tines substitution, but without knowledge and with superficiality ... by example I found two tone-bar inverted! ... how that's possible ?! you can see with a trivial visual inspection that one tonebar is longer that another ... :-(

Anyway I'm confident to restore soon or late this magical sound-maker;

now I need parts ...
* a part tines and pick-ups, that's annoying that I lack 4 legs :-(

BTW. could someone give me the lenght of original legs (closed)

thanks!
I think I ask a lathe turner to build this in a simpler form (no telescopic).

* Luckly I have the sustain pedal! brocken but I guess I could repair it.
BTW, I'm a ambient music composer ( http://solyaris.altervista.org ) and I'd love to realize open-sustain chords / clusters... :-)

* Another problem I now have is a strange static noise ... with a sort of "pick envelope" ...?! ... I fair this is due to the many dead pick-ups ...
I saw somewere that damper rail have been grounded ... maybe a compelete grounding wire will help ?

* Last but not least, tuning is not so trivial ... I used a guitar electronic tuner and do some regulations moving springs ... it happen that some notes appear slightly out-of-tune and a small spring regulation rebring in tune the note, BUT for certain notes, the tuning is very instable ... probably a bad tine oscillation ? ... I'll investigate.

* Probably the vintagetube suggestion to substitute all grommets is right for the correct vibration of tine/tonebar .. I guess I'll do this.

* About escapement, probably this is one of last point to verify because all before must run corrctly to do the right voicing regulation.

All suggestion is welcome! :-)
thanks
giorgio

Spaceduck · « **Reply #22 on:** May 28, 2010, 10:50:18 AM »

Quote from: "solyaris"

I know the piano have been played mainly in a Rehearsal studio...
it was usual in Italy in pop-rock-jazz rehearsal studios in '80s to have a rhodes as (almost) only keyboard in the studio ... and the players wa all sort of people...

I grew up playing one of those rehearsal Rhodes in highschool. It was awful how we (myself included) abused that thing. This was in the 80s when all I wanted was a Yamaha DX7 :roll:

Quote from: "solyaris"

BTW. could someone give me the lenght of original legs (closed) thanks!
I think I ask a lathe turner to build this in a simpler form (no telescopic).

I happen to have my Stage legs and a measuring tape right here. The rear legs are about 27" (68.5cm) including the 1/2" thread at the top. The front leg is slightly longer, about 27.5" (69cm) with the telescoping part pushed in as far as possible (see pic).

Back leg is 4 octaves, C# to D
Front leg is 4 octaves, C# to D#

Quote from: "solyaris"

* Another problem I now have is a strange static noise ... with a sort of "pick envelope" ...?! ... I fair this is due to the many dead pick-ups ...
I saw somewere that damper rail have been grounded ... maybe a compelete grounding wire will help ?

I had that problem, too. I tightened the grounding screws at both ends of the black wire & re-soldered the red wire at the jack (on the harp), and that fixed it. I'm not good with electronics, so I can't suggest anything if it's a dead pickup. Maybe you'll be lucky, and it will be easy to fix like mine was.

Good luck with the rest of it! Maybe someone else can give more advice.

solyaris · « **Reply #23 on:** May 29, 2010, 04:00:26 AM »

Hi Spaceduck, thanks a lot for your help.

Quote from: "Spaceduck"

I grew up playing one of those rehearsal Rhodes in highschool. It was awful how we (myself included) abused that thing. This was in the 80s when all I wanted was a Yamaha DX7 :roll:

[OT] more than ten years ago... I have been a DX7II "programmer" ... ( http://solyaris.altervista.org/dx7.htm ), and this is the ONLY ONE digital synth I kept during years... that's pheraps because this synth, even if digital, possess some "analogic" mistery as many electrical instruments possess ...

Quote from: "Spaceduck"

I happen to have my Stage legs and a measuring tape right here. The rear legs are about 27" (68.5cm) including the 1/2" thread at the top. The front leg is slightly longer, about 27.5" (69cm) with the telescoping part pushed in as far as possible (see pic).

Back leg is 4 octaves, C# to D
Front leg is 4 octaves, C# to D#

very kind of you for detailed info!

and congratulation for the unit of measurement in octaves!

just a last question if I'm not too boring: whit the legs mounted on the piano, what is the lenght (approximately, in cm) between the floor and the piano bottom layer (the flange), with with the telescoping part pushed in as far as possible as in your pic ?

Quote from: "Spaceduck"

Quote from: "solyaris"
* Another problem I now have is a strange static noise ... with a sort of "pick envelope" ...?! ... I fair this is due to the many dead pick-ups ...
I saw somewere that damper rail have been grounded ... maybe a compelete grounding wire will help ?

I had that problem, too. I tightened the grounding screws at both ends of the black wire & re-soldered the red wire at the jack (on the harp), and that fixed it.

yes, I just ordered used pick-ups to replace the 12 deads... hoping that with all pick-ups working, these strange noise effect (probably due to some impedence result) will go out. Me too yesterday I thought about replace the long ground black wire :idea:

giorgio

Tim Hodges · « **Reply #24 on:** May 29, 2010, 06:17:41 AM »

Quote from: "solyaris"

* Another problem I now have is a strange static noise ... with a sort of "pick envelope" ...?! ... I fair this is due to the many dead pick-ups ...
I saw somewere that damper rail have been grounded ... maybe a compelete grounding wire will help ?

* Last but not least, tuning is not so trivial ... I used a guitar electronic tuner and do some regulations moving springs ... it happen that some notes appear slightly out-of-tune and a small spring regulation rebring in tune the note, BUT for certain notes, the tuning is very instable ... probably a bad tine oscillation ? ... I'll investigate.

* Probably the vintagetube suggestion to substitute all grommets is right for the correct vibration of tine/tonebar .. I guess I'll do this.

giorgio

Hi Giorgio

Just to clarify is the damper bar grounded? best thing to do is to power up the Rhodes listen for the static then touch the damper bar with your hand, if the sound disappears then it's a grounding problem with the bar. It won't be too much of an issue if it isn't that so we'll get it sorted soon.

Secondly about the tine tuning, you'll find that on the extremes of the piano i.e the bass and the treble the tines are quite difficult to tune (even when the grommets are replaced) it just takes a lot of time and patience to get that sorted :-)

All the best!

Tim

solyaris · « **Reply #25 on:** May 29, 2010, 07:15:50 AM »

Quote from: "tjh392"

Hi Giorgio

Just to clarify is the damper bar grounded?

Hi Tim,
no, I mean not with a wire as in the photo I attached.

Quote

best thing to do is to power up the Rhodes listen for the static then touch the damper bar with your hand, if the sound disappears then it's a grounding problem with the bar.

you are right

, I'do the test!

Quote

Secondly about the tine tuning, you'll find that on the extremes of the piano i.e the bass and the treble the tines are quite difficult to tune (even when the grommets are replaced) it just takes a lot of time and patience to get that sorted :-)

Yes, I realized that on trebles ... generally speaking the tuning is not so easy as many people state ... or maybe it depend by my piano very bad conditions ... anyway Iìll going in deep with voicing in a secon step

thanks
giorgio

Tim Hodges · « **Reply #26 on:** February 03, 2011, 06:43:46 AM »

I decided to bring back this thread, I was curious to know how did spaceduck and solyaris get on with their restorations? I'll start adding in mine on Sunday.

T

solyaris · « **Reply #27 on:** February 03, 2011, 11:49:11 AM »

Quote from: tjh392 on February 03, 2011, 06:43:46 AM

I decided to bring back this thread, I was curious to know how did spaceduck and solyaris get on with their restorations? I'll start adding in mine on Sunday.

T

Hello

in facts I finished fase II restauration of my stage piano!
At the moment I'm satisfied by the result! generally every one of 73 notes sound pretty well now.

Here a two days ago sound check:
http://solyaris4.altervista.org/dumpeddelay.mp3

here two tracks of rhodes, passed on Digitech TSR24 5 sec delay patch...
please note I'm note a pianist, just a big lover of rhodes hypnotic sound ... possibly matching my music view ( http://solyaris.altervista.org ).

I retain it sound great!...Yes ...
1- some problems of lack of sustain on upper octaves ... (indeed lower octaves are amazing!)
2- and some problems here and there on the middle octaves where some very "hitted" seem to be affected of what I have see descibed as "exausted" tines syndrom ... possibly I'll detail this "minor" problem here in future.
3- Minor tuning difficulties especially on the two upper octave...

Even if I confess restauration have been hard. I do all by myself and I'm neither a pianist, neither a rhodes expert ...
and I thank you VINTAGEVIBE Video and all helped me here in this forum!!

Thanks to all!
giorgio

Tines&Reeds · « **Reply #28 on:** June 16, 2011, 10:45:16 AM »

Hey folks,

the last weekend I tolexed a rhodes for a customer. Look at the pictures.
It's not real Tweed. It's just Tweed-Vinyl but it looks cool I think. Also it has new hardware, new hammertips and new damperfelts.

Tim Hodges · « **Reply #29 on:** June 17, 2011, 02:24:00 AM »

Nice work! it's a definite improvement, the tweed looks awesome. I'm currently re-tolexing a late MK1 which somebody had attempted to do earlier. Instead of using tolex they used something similar which has the thickness and tear-ability of paper. It's was also attached to the case using superglue making it very very difficult to take off! I'm going to have to sand it off as I can't peel any more off.

T

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Author Topic: Restoration Thread - Show us Pics of your work! (Read 50147 times)