Author Topic: Unable to tune first few notes  (Read 2320 times)

Offline e-soul91

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Unable to tune first few notes
« on: February 01, 2017, 07:48:55 AM »
OK, here is the following:

The first note, which should be E can't be tuned to E, but instead is C, and I can maximum make it D by pulling the spring all the way down. Is there anything I am missing? Moving a pickup forward and back only increases volume, not the pitch, right? And moving the tine up and down by tightening and loosening tone bar screws doesn't do much either.

Same thing is with two following notes: F,G and their sharp and flat companions.

I am obviously missing something.
'77 Mark I Stage 73

"If butter had a sound, it would sound like Rhodes piano" -someone from the internet.

Offline sean

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Re: Unable to tune first few notes
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2017, 01:27:23 PM »


Either the tines are slightly too short, or the tuning spring is too small.  If you have extra tuning springs, you can add a second spring to that tine.

The tuning springs on the very low notes should have five windings on either side of the split.  So they look like /////\\\\\.  If the spring has only three windings, ///\\\, then it is too small.

Moving the pickup is not supposed to affect pitch, and is not used for tuning a note.  However, sometimes I have to re-tune a note after moving the pickup very very close to the tine tip.

If the tines are all short, you can buy one long tine, and replace the longest bad note with that new tine, then use the tine you just removed to replace the next note, and so on.

If you have a yardstick (sorry, USA joke)... I mean, if you have a ruler, or dial calipers, you can measure the tines to see how bad the situation is.

I assume we are talking about the very lowest notes on the 1977 Rhodes 73-key piano.  Here is how long your tines should be:

#8 - E - 156.4mm
#9 - F - 152.4mm
#10 - F# - 148.4mm
#11 - G - 143.7mm
#12 - G# - 140.5mm
#13 - A - 135.7mm
#14 - A# - 131.4mm

Sean











Offline e-soul91

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Re: Unable to tune first few notes
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2017, 01:57:57 PM »
Never thought about measuring the tine. It seems long enough to me, but who knows, maybe few millimeters short can really make a huge difference. Will measure it. Also, do I measure the whole tine, with that thing where you screw it to a tone bar, or just a thin wire part?
'77 Mark I Stage 73

"If butter had a sound, it would sound like Rhodes piano" -someone from the internet.

Offline sean

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Re: Unable to tune first few notes
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2017, 03:56:09 PM »

Just measure the part of the tine that sticks out of the block.  (If you try to measure it any other way, you would know something was way off, well, 9.5mm off.)

See http://www.fenderrhodes.com/service/manual.html

Specifically, see the bottom of http://www.fenderrhodes.com/org/manual/fig6-2.gif

Sean

Offline e-soul91

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Re: Unable to tune first few notes
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2017, 04:04:37 PM »

Just measure the part of the tine that sticks out of the block.  (If you try to measure it any other way, you would know something was way off, well, 9.5mm off.)

See http://www.fenderrhodes.com/service/manual.html

Specifically, see the bottom of http://www.fenderrhodes.com/org/manual/fig6-2.gif

Sean

Oh, OK. So block it is called. Gotcha. Thank you very much for your help. :)
'77 Mark I Stage 73

"If butter had a sound, it would sound like Rhodes piano" -someone from the internet.

Offline e-soul91

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Re: Unable to tune first few notes
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2017, 08:24:35 AM »
So, checked the length, turned out it's OK. Now the only option I have is to add second tuning spring, can't think of anything else.
'77 Mark I Stage 73

"If butter had a sound, it would sound like Rhodes piano" -someone from the internet.

Offline pianotuner steveo

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Re: Unable to tune first few notes
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2017, 08:31:21 AM »
That is correct. Add a spring to all tines that can't be tuned flat enough. Moving the pickup doesn't help. The bass tine springs are larger and heavier, maybe someone put smaller springs on them. It is very common to see 2 springs on the lowest tines.
1960 Wurlitzer model 700 EP
1968 Gibson G101 Combo organ
1975 Rhodes Piano Bass
1979 Wurlitzer 206A EP
1980 Wurlitzer 270 Butterfly Grand
2004 Hammond XK3
2009 73A Rhodes Mark 7
2009 Korg SV-1 73
2017 Yamaha P255
2020 Kawai CA99
....and a few guitars...

Offline e-soul91

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Re: Unable to tune first few notes
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2017, 01:19:49 PM »
That is correct. Add a spring to all tines that can't be tuned flat enough. Moving the pickup doesn't help. The bass tine springs are larger and heavier, maybe someone put smaller springs on them. It is very common to see 2 springs on the lowest tines.

Thanks, will do. I have also noticed how I had to retune other notes as I have moved pickups a bit close (I wanted louder "bark", you know what I am talking about, and some notes just sounded too quiet). Most of them got few more cents offset. Regarding bass tines, I have ordered tuning springs. The notes bothering me are lowest: E, F, F# and G. Everything from G# onwards is fine. I will survive without those four for now, lol.
'77 Mark I Stage 73

"If butter had a sound, it would sound like Rhodes piano" -someone from the internet.

Offline pianotuner steveo

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Re: Unable to tune first few notes
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2017, 05:09:10 PM »
Yes, the pickup can confuse your ears' perception of the tuning if it's too close, but it doesn't actually change the tuning. Similar,yet different from the Doppler effect.

« Last Edit: February 04, 2017, 09:09:20 PM by pianotuner steveo »
1960 Wurlitzer model 700 EP
1968 Gibson G101 Combo organ
1975 Rhodes Piano Bass
1979 Wurlitzer 206A EP
1980 Wurlitzer 270 Butterfly Grand
2004 Hammond XK3
2009 73A Rhodes Mark 7
2009 Korg SV-1 73
2017 Yamaha P255
2020 Kawai CA99
....and a few guitars...