Reed Bar Shields

[MoonSide]

Hi,

If you watched my video in my previous post, you heard the big Hum emanates from my wurly 200. I'll have to buy a Reed Bar Shields.

Between these two models, which one is more effective ?

http://vintagemusicparts.com/wurlitzershield.htm

http://www.vintagevibe.com/collections/wurlitzer-parts-hardware/products/wurlitzer-reed-bar-shields?variant=899468575

Thanks for your help.

[pianotuner steveo]

You have a 200 and not a 200A, correct?

The larger style came with 200A, 206A, and other models. I have some of these if you are interested. I have no experience with installing the other (reed bar) style. I believe the A models already have those, but I would have to look.

[echoisc]

I have a extra set of the reed bar shields for the 200 series that I bought from VV.  I tried to install on a 726 model but they didn't fit right. If you need them I will sell for $40.  Just as a side note. But on the question of which to use, I would say both.

[MoonSide]

Yes Steveo, I have a 200.

Is it possible to use bothit is possible to use two types of shielding ?

Maybe seen the loud hum that I have, I should install two ....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWx0RvVIhr4

[pianotuner steveo]

That B note and others that are functioning that way are letting off too early. Your action needs to be regulated.

[MoonSide]

Steveo thank you. I'll try to make this famous let-off adjustment hoping that my piano turns into a real Wurlitzer

[MoonSide]

so I started to make some adjustments. unfortunately I do not hear a lot of difference 

here is a picture of my tips. How do you find? there is no such, this may be why the sound is so small and uneven ...

[pianotuner steveo]

Those are the dampers. I'm not really sure what you are asking.

[MoonSide]

I want to show you the shape of my tips, which are very irregular. I think it does not help the piano to sound good.

I ordered the mold. Would it be a good thing to redo properly?

[pianotuner steveo]

The reed tips?

No, it won't help. The reeds have nothing to do with your sound problem except possibly the treble reed bar needs to be aligned better.

The action needs to be regulated. do you have the proper letoff tool?

What is this mold I keep hearing about?

Something to do with making reeds?

I would start with the regulation. The hammers are letting off too soon. This makes the keys quiet, and have a poor feel. If you have to hit a key real hard to make it sound, it's letting off too soon.

If your hammers block against the reeds or break the reeds, it is letting off too late or not at all.

[MoonSide]

Sorry I forgot to specify. I'm talking reed tips. I thought not having the shape of the pyramid, as recommended in the manual, the sound is not homogeneous and not always pleasant.
But I wanted to have your opinion on that.

ok I'll try to align those trebles to see if it is improving.

Just a precision, to be on, when you say "too soon", it means that we must tighten the screw or loosen the screw ?

I started to regulate letoff with a key 5mm, but I ordered the special key in ep-service. I did not know that you sold this tool. I know the wish is angled, it's probably more convenient ...

The reed mold : http://www.vintagevibe.com/collections/wurlitzer-parts-reeds/products/wurlitzer-reed-mold?variant=899462531

[MoonSide]

About the Hum :

Here's a little test I did with my ipod. I wanted to know if the hum came from the amp or the harp. When I plug the iPod is total silence, no hum.

Surely with the shield that it will get better, but I think I'll also go all the RCA cable with shielded cable and quality RCA plug.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvqAnpeDhwo

[cinnanon]

Unplug the input totally and see if it still hums. If it doesn't hum, then there's an issue with the grounding on the reedbar.
Also, I'm not an electronics guru, but the wurlitzer amp puts something like 170VDC thru that RCA input and I'm not so sure it's good for an iPod.

[pianotuner steveo]

No, Cinnamonrolli, the Dc voltage is not coming OUT of the RCA jack you would plug the ipod into. It should be safe when you unplug the reed bar. Otherwise, he would have had a problem when he did that. Probably would have killed the ipod.

[cinnanon]

Ah I see!  I couldn't tell if he was using two separate jacks in the video. The 200 amps usually don't have the 1/4" input jack wired up.

[DocWurly]

MoonSide,

Those are two different parts.  Both should be on there.  The one on that vintage vibe link was standard on the 200A, not originally included on the 200.

It is my understanding that similar reed bar shields are included with Retrolinear's replacement amp for the 200. I've yet to install any of these shields on a 200.

http://www.retrolinear.com/web-store/wurlitzer-replacement-parts.aspx

The Wurlitzer has a pickup that is running along some 4 feet of reeds.  The hum is inevitable --impossible to avoid-- if you don't have that shielding....because the pickup is "picking up" all sorts of other electomagnetic signals in the air.  (That's my limited understanding).  There is some sort of shielding on every single Wurlitzer.

The weakness of the model 200 (vs the 200A) was its amp.  It was noisy and unpowerful compared to the 200A.  And, perhaps over time, these 200-era amps have all started to fail, too, in some way or other, making them even weaker.

This is probably the nature of your problem.  It's generally advisable to replace the 200 amps.

Hi,

If you watched my video in my previous post, you heard the big Hum emanates from my wurly 200. I'll have to buy a Reed Bar Shields.

Between these two models, which one is more effective ?

http://vintagemusicparts.com/wurlitzershield.htm

http://www.vintagevibe.com/collections/wurlitzer-parts-hardware/products/wurlitzer-reed-bar-shields?variant=899468575

Thanks for your help.

[MoonSide]

Thank you Paleophone for all these clarifications.

I will not immediately replace my amp. While it is not very powerful, but someting said he is well. I replaced many components above. I'll redo the RCA plug with shielded wire, and equip me with a shield Reed bar. I think it should alleviate the Hum. I am aware that I do not will delete. I also have a slight hum on my Twin Reverb, on my Hammond and my Leslie, so I live very well with. It is the joy of Vintage :-)

What worried me the most is the adjustment of the mechanical and sound. I don't know if I can some-thing that pleases me, as I could do with my Rhodes. For example I have problems with double-strike and for now I can not eliminate them. And some reed sound bad, with little sustain. If you have any advice I'm interested. 

[Tim Hodges]

Sorry to pickup on this thread. But I have a similar problem with a 200 at the moment. Board has been re-capped and gone over and sounds fine without the reed bar input connected.

I've built a new RCA cable to connect it to the harp and my next thought is to check the grounding and then look at a pickup shield from Vintage Vibe.

My assumption was that of cinnanon's that a high voltage goes through that RCA socket on the PCB. Is it ok to connect an iPod or iPhone through it? (Because I'll give it a go if it's actually safe to do)

Thanks
Tim

[sean]

Do NOT plug your iPod into the RCA jack that is on the amp board.  There is indeed high voltage on the center pin of that RCA jack.

Here is the link to the Wurly 200 manual posted to Vintage Vibe's shopify account:
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0666/2821/files/Wurlitzer_200_and_200A_Service_Manual.pdf?8872610067384662061

Go down to page 38, and tilt your head sideways to read the schematic.   (Or right click and select "Rotate Clockwise.")

On the upper left of the schematic, there is an input to the amp shown as coming in on terminals 1 and 3.  If you look at the board layout on page 28, you will see those pads on the left side of the board below the RCA jack.  Send your audio test signal into there (terminal 1 is ground, terminal 3 is audio).

Sean

[Tim Hodges]

Good, I was going to say it seems like a crazy idea and I didn't want to fry my phone but I was surprised to see a few people suggesting it on here.

Thanks Sean.

[pianotuner steveo]

Are you guys sure that the DC voltage is present in that RCA jack if you unplug the Reed bar? I though it came through that wire from the Reed bar and into the Jack on the board....in that case, unplugging the wire would remove the voltage.
Tim, if you own a volt meter, check to see if the 150vdc (or so) is coming FROM the RCA wire by unplugging the wire and testing there. I think the Reed bar voltage is generated in the Reed bar pre amp, not from the amp board.

[sean]

The fact that there is an RCA jack on the amp board indicates that this is a Model 200, not a 200A.
The 200 doesn't have that little circuit board up on the center of the reed bar.
The high voltage for the reed bar on a model 200 comes from the RCA jack on the amp board.


The 200A would have the little preamp board on the reed bar, but that would be connected to the main amp board by wires without an RCA connector.
On the 200A, the high voltage does indeed come from the blue wire on the transformer, to the main amp board, but leaves the amp board without touching anything in the audio path by the terminal #18 at the bottom of the schematic, and that goes to the preamp board that is mounted on the reed bar.

The 200A schematic posted by VV is pretty fuzzy, but it is on page 66 of the shopify link I posted above.

Sean

[Tim Hodges]

The fact that there is an RCA jack on the amp board indicates that this is a Model 200, not a 200A.
The 200 doesn't have that little circuit board up on the center of the reed bar.
The high voltage for the reed bar on a model 200 comes from the RCA jack on the amp board.


The 200A would have the little preamp board on the reed bar, but that would be connected to the main amp board by wires without an RCA connector.
On the 200A, the high voltage does indeed come from the blue wire on the transformer, to the main amp board, but leaves the amp board without touching anything in the audio path by the terminal #18 at the bottom of the schematic, and that goes to the preamp board that is mounted on the reed bar.

The 200A schematic posted by VV is pretty fuzzy, but it is on page 66 of the shopify link I posted above.

Sean

Sean is right, it's a '68 Model 200 so there is no separate preamp amp it's all contained within that single PCB with the reed bar being supplied that voltage through the RCA socket.

Thanks for the useful tip on testing the PCB through the mic input (terminals 1 & 3) I'll hook it up this weekend when I get a chance and double check the amp. I'm pretty sure the problem lies somewhere with the reed bar as the amp is pretty quiet when not connected.

[pianotuner steveo]

Wow...senior moment. Lol

I forgot there is no RCA on the 200A...


Like I've said many times, I just don't work on many of these anymore.