How to beef up a mellow tone?

[fundikira]

Hello

I have a Rhodes Mark II with plastic keys, which I play through a Peavey Classic 30 guitar amp.  I got it fixed up by a tech, and it sounds pretty good now especially through that amp.  The tech however said that the guy I bought it from had kind of rebuilt the piano using spare parts, and had got some of the dimensions etc. inside a bit wrong (eg. the harp cover doesn't actually fit on properly).  As a result, quite a few of the notes, when you play them too hard, choke (double-strike?).  It's not too bad though, and the tech said that it's as good as it's going to get.  But because I can't play too loud, the dynamic range of the piano is a little bit limited: it always sounds pretty mellow.  I play jazz, and the mellow sound is beautiful, but when the intensity of the music lifts, I need to be able to cut through the band a bit more.  I have tried putting some overdrive on it, but because of the limited dynamic range, the overdriven sound is too harsh for the quiet bits, while the non-overdriven sound is not harsh enough for the loud bits etc.  .  .  So here are my questions:

1.  What do you think I can do to the sound of the rhodes (effects, eq, whatever) to get a sound that is a bit less mellow and cuts through the band a bit better?
2.  How do you think I can switch between the mellow sound and the harsher sound as the intensity of the music varies in a live performance.  I have thought about just using a volume pedal to vary the volume of the piano as the intensity of the music changes, but I'm not sure if an increase in volume would really solve the problem of the mellow tone.  I suppose using a volume pedal to control the intensity of an effects pedal of some sort might be the go?  Anyway I guess using a volume pedal and overdrive might do it, because with more volume comes more overdrive.

I really look forward to hearing your ideas
Thanks

[tnelson]

Spend a little time with the Rhodes service manual and the Tech Notes at www.FenderRhodes.com. Your choking notes are symptomatic of the need for further adjustment of escapement or dampers. If you need more dynamic range and a less-mellow timbre, you may wish to adjust pickup-to-tine distance and alignment. If you need more ability to be heard distinctly in a band mix, I'd rethink how you are amplifying. The Rhodes Stage Piano is a passive output instrument like an electric guitar. If you just output to a guitar amp without boosting and shaping the signal, you get output that is usually pretty muddy, or "mellow," depending on your point of view. Simplest option is to add a preamp with some tone control in front of the guitar amp. Even with a preamp, though, most guitar amps have a midrange-heavy tonal shape that works against a balanced sound for the Rhodes. Better to output from a preamp to a clean PA or powered mixer with EQ, so you can balance your Rhodes sound and can shape it as needed for a particular performance situation. If you're playing jazz, you probably want a clean balanced piano sound instead of a muddy or distorted sound, and a preamp plus EQ allows you to achieve this. Sometimes the inability to "cut through" a band mix is more due to the failure of the other players to play with dynamics that give space to a soloist. Unfortunately, a lot of groups seem to rely on the sound man to create that space at the mixing board.  Good luck!

[andi85]

well...i´m not an expert for the interiors of your rhodes. so i guess i can´t really help you.

what you can try to do is - as tnelson said - use a preamp. i have the bbe di100x, which is quite the same as the major key harmonic clarifier. it gives your tone more treble and more bass if you want to. it sounds much brighter, clearer and a bit harder.

then - but that´s a matter of taste - you could try to take the rhodes signal directly from the harp. on the left upper side of the harp there is a cinch-connection to the control panels. if you take a cinch-to-line-adaptor and plug a line cable into it, you get an extra "click" when the hammers hit the tine and a bit more treble. if you like the sound or not, however, is a matter of taste. i find it pretty cool

the question "pa or guitar amp"...well, it depends...i have a good active speaker - a dynacord am12 - and of course i tried it with my rhodes.
well, you get a nice mellow sound, but for me there wasn´t enough attack, not enough aggression. i could beat the piano like a madman, but it sounded always kind of the same. i tried it with the bbe-box, with a normal di-box and the microphone-channel of the dynacord - nothing.
with my fender hotrod i´ve got enough bite. so i guess it´s a matter of combination.

maybe a rhodes with the pickups set "close" might work very well with a pa-speaker due to its own attack, but i could never try it.
i´m very glad to have the additional attack of my fender, because i guess my rhodes has not a too aggressive setup e.g. there is only little pickup distortion.

how do you like your peavey? i was interested in getting one, but i found the fender used with new tubes in my music shop. the price was great, so i took it.

[tnelson]

What andi85 is illustrating by tapping the harp directly and bypassing the volume/treble/bass controls on the Rhodes is the weakness of a passive instrument. Those controls are passive and only filter the signal. Loss only, no boost. Just passing through those pots full on will cause some loss of high frequency, as andi 85 has noticed. I'd certainly bypass these pots if you use a preamp, to avoid unwanted filtering---that's how the Major Key preamp installs.

[andi85]

oh, right. thanks for the explanation. that´s exactly what i wanted to say.

but on the other hand it doesn´t sound so bad with the preamp and the control panel. it´s just a nuance, but it´s certainly worth a try